Redating the great sphinx of giza schoch

Great sphinx of giza carbon dating

distant sites (jericho and nabta) fail to provide the early context for the sphinx that schoch has sought. of an artificial hollow (ditch or enclosure), and the walls of the sphinx enclosure. the age of the oldest portion of the sphinx (here it is important to remember that the. with respect to the possibility of links with jericho, michael baigent in his book ancient traces16 links predynastic pots found at giza (see also my paper2), to evidence of traders from the jericho region who had settled in the late predynastic town of maadi, across the nile valley from giza. giza plateau),what effects it had on the stone, and so forth, are all open questions. although it is beyond question that these tombs will have been exposed to rainfall, the fact that they are not significantly degraded, as schoch has pointed out, demonstrates that rainfall itself has not been a significant agent of degradation in egypt. ogilvie-herald, 1999, giza: the truth: the people,Politics and history behind the world’s most famous archaeological site. a contemporaneous (thus older) sphinx temple (at least the limestone core being older.[16 km] from giza) there are fragile mudbrick mastabas that are indisputably dated to the. the dating of the great sphinx remains controversial (after all, old ideas die hard), and the analyses of nabta playa are questionable in the eyes of some researchers, there is one site that even the most ensconced conventional archaeologists cannot ignore. to build the sphinx temple (as clearly stated by lawton and ogilvie-herald in their.. anonymous, “the bucegi – sphinx,” article dated 10 october 2002 and posted at: www. of weathering under the floor of the sphinx temple may be considered abnormally shallow. in their joint paper21, dobecki and schoch report that s9 indicated weathering to 1. schoch, “redating the great sphinx of giza”, kmt, a modern journal of ancient egypt, vol. international symposium on the great sphinx: towards global treatment of the sphinx. schoch’s ‘weathered zone’ may, therefore, be a function of the structure of the member i rock – reflecting the bedding of the limestones beneath the sphinx enclosure. [a predecessor of khafre, the "traditional" builder of the sphinx] and located.(western end) of the sphinx which we sampled seismically in april 1991 was exposed later. (high durability) for the uppermost bed just below the neck of the sphinx to about. north of the great sphinx on the terrace area in order to acquire velocities on. be sure there are other types of erosion, besides water run-off going on at the sphinx enclosure and on the sphinx itself, but almost all parties agree more or less on the basics of the others these days, even the mainstream guys. in my opinion, they do not show any characteristics that are diagnostic or even suggestive of having been formed by artificial dredging of the sphinx enclosure, as some have suggested. reader’s response to this is typical of the other geologists that have reviewed schoch’s claims in this regard. up into the sphinx and the surrounding rocks may account for much of this activity. he covers in the preceding portions of his paper] implies that the sphinx is at. has also suggested that the sphinx and sphinx enclosure have. is necessary to question, however, the validity of schoch’s key assumption: that the results of the seismic geophysics actually represent evidence for weathering rather than some other factor. as seen on the western end of the sphinx enclosure, much less to account for the. is consistent, however, with the reconstructed scenario of the excavation of the sphinx. for the nabta playa, well the sphinx and sphinx temple actually have very little in common with the stone circle discovered at this site in southern egypt (dated to approximately 6000bc18). temple (which reader refers to as the "proto-mortuary temple"), and the sphinx. should note that reader clearly accepts the sphinx temple as. valley temples, 3) ancient repair campaigns to the body of the sphinx, and 4) seismic. -- such as the age of the initial carving of the sphinx relative to other. sphinx serves as a catchment area for any subsequent runoff. i have recounted elsewhere,3 my colleague and friend john anthony west had suggested to me various silly notions that the great sphinx might be older than the standard egyptological attribution of circa 2500 bce.: i do not find dating the sphinx on the basis of “the known use of stone in ancient egyptian architecture” convincing. primarily because if the erosion was caused by the water drainage coming into the enclosure, then the sphinx would have had to have been built before the quarries which lay to the west. however, the kmt article simplified the original seismic work, omitting any discussion of seismic line s9, which ran across the floor of the sphinx temple. of the granite has been removed from the sphinx temple and much of the exterior granite. body of the great sphinx occurred during the period of approximately 7,000 to 5,000. others have noted schoch’s work to promote the idea of  a prehistoric alien visitation and similar ideas.) the vertical fissures observed in the walls of the sphinx enclosure show diagnostic signs of having been formed by precipitation and water runoff.

Redating the great sphinx of giza schoch

the work of gauri, for a younger sphinx hinges on the assertion that its present style and., 1999, 2000), i have come out strongly in favor of not only an older sphinx, but. on the sphinx's body or the presence of open fissures. from these findings, he concluded that if the back passage was excavated by khafra, then the main body of the sphinx would have stood on an exposed floor beginning sometime between 4750 and 7000 bce. on the giza plateau (discussed above), and the seismic surveys in the area of. of an older sphinx, lawton and ogilvie-herald write: "finally, west and schoch have. the scale of the two monuments could not be different, the sphinx is some 74m long, whereas the nabta circle is only 4m in diameter. furthermore, the nature of the surface erosion throughout the enclosure and on the body of the sphinx is as expected if there were water running over or raining down on the rock layers. is found only on the oldest structures of the giza plateau to any significant degree,Such as the body of the sphinx and the walls of the sphinx enclosure. to be found on all giza plateau structures to some small degree; here we are talking. the core body of the sphinx was excavated), no matter what the climate is like. conceivable that architectural stonework was being pursued at giza prior to 2800. “redating the great sphinx of giza”)) which is of course far earlier than the conventional date for the construction of the sphinx (during the reign of the pharaoh khafra c. if these depths are plotted on an east-west section through the sphinx enclosure and sphinx temple (bearing in mind that the floor of the sphinx temple is cut three metres lower than the floor of the sphinx enclosure) the ‘weathered’ depths can be connected by a sub-horizontal line that closely parallels the dip of the strata., 1988, geologic features and durability of limestones at the sphinx, in engineering. western-most end of the core body of the sphinx in the vicinity of where we ran our. the sphinx enclosure closely and i have observed no signs of such spring-like seepages,Either in the recent or distant past. body of the sphinx, carved from the bedrock, sits largely below ground level, and various moat, pool, or artificial fountain hypotheses have been suggested for the sphinx from time to time. on old kingdom giza plateau structures (which exhibit primarily wind-induced weathering. sphinx was freed from the bedrock, and to establish a chronology of the possible widening.) the subsurface seismic data demonstrating the depth of weathering below the floor of the sphinx enclosure, based on my analyses (using areas excavated during the old kingdom for comparison), even when calibrated very conservatively, gives an age of initial carving for the core body of the great sphinx of at least 5000 bce. flooding, however, would be expected to cut a wave bench into the sphinx and. action of rainfall run-off discharging into the sphinx enclosure from the higher. -- giza egypt, in the first international symposium on the great sphinx: towards., by estimating when the less weathered portion of the sphinx enclosure was. zahi hawass22 has indicated that a number of masonry blocks on the rear of the sphinx, date from the fourth dynasty.) even the conventional date for the sphinx allows for a couple hundred years of light rainfall. corroborated by the correlation between the nature of the weathering in the sphinx. i have discussed in my book, voices of the rocks (schoch with. giza plateau has an eastward sloping topography which causes a natural rainwater run-off into the west part of the sphinx enclosure which would erode the limestone along the exposed western enclosure walls and selectively exploit any joints exposed along the cut face. but again this transitional period between 7000 bc and 2350 bc had plenty of rain, and even short bursts of rain which would cause the kind of flash flooding that could cause very quick erosion, reader sites other examples of this on the giza plateau in the excerpt above. the great sphinx was weathered heavily, and at an early period,By precipitation, this suggests that it may have been carved prior to the last period of. seen on the great sphinx and associated structures predate old kingdom times,And in fact may well predate dynastic times. however,It alone cannot account for all of the weathering features seen in the sphinx enclosure,And more importantly it alone cannot account for the specific distribution of weathering. given the number of people who have been asking me about this latest “sphinx theory,” i feel it is imperative that i briefly address it here.. again, this train of thought suggests that the sphinx and walls of the sphinx ditch. features in the sphinx enclosure form a relatively minor overlay on the., well-documented old kingdom tombs on the giza plateau, cut from the identical. shaft tombs and other structures found on the giza plateau, but they are. expected if the sphinx had not been carved until 2800 b. the giza plateau, concentrating in particular on the area of the sphinx enclosure. low-velocity layer immediately behind the rump of the sphinx is totally incompatible. damaging the great sphinx may not be of relevance when attempting to determine. in the masonry covering the lower part of the body [of the sphinx], a red powder.

Robert M. Schoch - Wikipedia

in the sphinx enclosure, and there was not sufficient runoff after the quarrying work. will produce the weathering and erosional profile seen on the body of the sphinx."prove" that the temples, and therefore the sphinx itself, must date to khafre's time. the fourth dynasty, then the great sphinx was built prior to the reign of khafre. conclusion, i think that the following points are persuasive:The very selective severe weathering, on the western side of the enclosure wall, and not on the other sides of the enclosure, or on the sphinx itself are very positive signs for reader’s theory being true, especially considering the positive evidence for the sphinx enclosure being a natural drainage for the plateau. porous sand piled up in the sphinx enclosure will not significantly protect the. it all over the last two decades, i have looked at the alternative theories suggested to explain the data, and i continue to maintain that the evidence clearly points to the origins of the great sphinx being much older than 2500 bce. i), and if the entire body of the great sphinx was carved out of living rock at one. i would also note that the chambers and tunnels under the great sphinx would have been flooded from above if the great sphinx had been sitting in a pool of water, unless the sphinx enclosure had been watertight; yet the evidence suggests the enclosure was not watertight. (running from the area of the sphinx , sphinx temple, and khafre valley temple. temple5 has proposed a moat theory (that is, the sphinx enclosure was purposefully filled with water such that the body of the sphinx was submerged and sat as a statue in a small artificial lake) to explain the clear signs of water weathering and erosion on the body of the great sphinx and on the walls of the sphinx enclosure. the sphinx enclosure were completely covered with standing water that did not evaporate. to explain away the degradation features seen in the sphinx enclosure. parkhomenko, “geological aspect of the problem of dating the great egyptian sphinx construction”, in geoarchaeology and archaeomineralogy (eds. the sphinx and other structures during the present day, this mechanism does not. body of the sphinx is composed) and the weathered rosetau member (which forms the. significant deterioration of the sphinx since the beginning of the twentieth century. limestone blocks, i believe that the limestone core blocks of both the sphinx. that the sphinx spent most of its 4,500 year history buried in sand. than the traditional date for the origins of the sphinx -- in the reign of khafre,Another geologist, colin reader, has also pursued a meticulous. of the sphinx temple was lowered and resurfaced during old kingdom restorations and.. for the oldest portion of the sphinx, a date that. of the sphinx and on the walls of the sphinx enclosure, this has been discussed at. the younger, western-most floor of the sphinx enclosure to reach a depth of about four. according to schoch's theory must have been carved only c. sphinx was done with typical old kingdom style masonry, but the core body of the. in particular, the rump or rear of the sphinx was carved out or. in the sphinx enclosure and on the body of the sphinx. khafre is based on circumstantial evidence to begin with (see schoch with mcnally,1999, 2000), i find one conclusion inescapable -- the initial construction (carving) of. arguments against an older great sphinx in their book giza: the truth (1999)., on the body of the great sphinx itself, and on the walls of the valley and sphinx. the level of the terrace the back of the sphinx merged with the bedrock. important point, because in the case of the body of the sphinx only the back (top) of., with robert aquinas mcnally, 2000,“epilogue: an update to the redating of the sphinx, and other pertinent matters” in voices. also in an interesting twist, in a june 2005 interview schoch endorses reader’s theory about the water run-off and the quarries, but says he doesn’t think that even with run-off being the primary agent of erosion, it would be enough water to cause the erosion seen on the western enclosure wall, obviously implying that he still thinks it needs the increased rainfall of his much earlier period. in this way, schoch‘s was able to ‘confirm’ his early date for the sphinx, which he had initially established on the basis of a known period of rainfall. 47-52 (january-february 2009); robert temple with olivia temple, the sphinx mystery: the forgotten origins of the sanctuary of anubis, rochester, vermont: inner traditions, 2009. exposed, the limestone floor on the western end of the sphinx..Filed under: ancient civilizations, articles tagged with: egypt, göbekli tepe, sphinx. in their first season, yoshimura et al used gpr with a frequency of 150mhz and identified two potential cavities in front of the sphinx. this is the most minor component of weathering observed on the giza. on the great sphinx: towards global treatment of the sphinx. earliest repairs to the body of the sphinx have been carried out using what appear. the ancient degradation patterns observed on the sphinx's body and in the sphinx. 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The Age of the Sphinx? Colin Reader vs. Robert Schoch – Water

erosion] towards the west [western end] of the sphinx enclosure. not opened up as fissures everywhere on the giza plateau. in his recent criticism of g:tt8, schoch appears to advocate arid, sub-aerial weathering as the main agent of this degradation, dismissing the effect of modern rainfall etc. the very earliest portion of the sphinx dates back to before 7000 b. body of the great sphinx on either side (east [seismic line s4], north [seismic line s1],And south [seismic line s2] of the sphinx) indicate that below the surface the limestone is. weathering factor that is currently taking place on the giza plateau. alternatively, the rump or western end of the sphinx may have been originally. on the giza plateau occasionally, and thus precipitation-induced weathering can be. of the sphinx, and pointing out that other explanations (for instance, as proposed. both of these areas, behind the rump of the sphinx and north of the sphinx temple,Were widened at the same time -- presumably around the time of khafre. layers lower in the section, thus corroborating the hypothesis of an older sphinx. sphinx and walls of the sphinx enclosure are the result of the various effects of. very different from the great sphinx and the sphinx temple, in my estimation, taking the entire göbekli tepe site as a whole into account, just as much effort, social organisation, and sophisticated or high culture must have been required to construct the göbekli tepe complex as the sphinx complex. body of the great sphinx, our seismic work also revealed several other interesting. (or at least should be) operating on all of the limestone surfaces of the giza plateau,Yet somehow virtually no other surfaces show the same type of weathering and erosional profile.(degradation) on the sphinx and in the sphinx enclosure is much different than what would. schoch, “geological evidence pertaining to the age of the great sphinx”, in new scenarios on the evolution of the solar system and consequences on history of earth and man (eds. schoch’s opinion, however, the seismic geophysical surveys undertaken by dr thomas dobecki and himself21 confirm his pre-5000bc date for the original construction of the sphinx. age of the great sphinx as far as i am concerned. “with slight modification” supports the dating of the great sphinx to the fourth. the top and the bottom parts are much stronger than the middle part which makes up most of the body of the sphinx, and is badly eroded by a number of factors. his original kmt article5 schoch discusses four seismic lines within the sphinx enclosure. robert schoch plus all the latest discoveries in the world of archaeology. the sphinx and lacking the "vertical and rounded profiles," may have been excavated. (member ii or setepet member) of the core body or thoracic region of the sphinx. and degradation of limestone bedrock as seen in the sphinx enclosure. of his paper (page 17), continues: "nevertheless, it [the sphinx] is clearly. least weathered and receded in profile (assuming that the wall of the sphinx ditch was. i continue to believe that the erosional features on the sphinx and in the. the same limestone that surrounds the great sphinx (the floor of the sphinx enclosure. other words there is more than enough rain to cause the erosion during the time that reader is proposing for the sphinx, especially when you consider that reader’s theory needs only a tiny fraction of the rainfall that schoch’s theory needs. western end of the sphinx enclosure or the body of the sphinx itself. (remember, too, that to carve the core body of the sphinx huge multi-ton blocks were removed from the sphinx enclosure and assembled as the sphinx temple, so the original sphinx temple is as old as the core body of the great sphinx). i will quote from reader’s article published in the journal archaeometry called “a geomorphological study of the giza necropolis, with implications for the development of the site:”. the surface of the floor of the sphinx enclosure, and it is weathered limestone (and. contends that the moat theory explains the data adequately without hypothesising that the great sphinx dates back to a much earlier period during which there was more rainfall than at present. personally, i am not convinced that the great sphinx is anywhere close to the age postulated by manichev and parkhomenko, or that various claimed very ancient, very eroded statues are anything more than natural formations, but the prospects are intriguing.-shaped hill) hypothesis for the sphinx as a whole is untenable (see el-baz, 1981,1982), the head may have originally been a yardang (which would mean that it was some. sides or rear), such that, with the sphinx temple before it, the sphinx seems to sit on.-most portions of the sphinx and the floor of the sphinx enclosure). that the sphinx was originally meant to be viewed from the front (rather than from. however,One must account for the considerable weathering that appears on the walls of the sphinx. directly from the ditch around the sphinx (see the work of aigner, 1982, 1983a,1983b, 1983c, and lehner, 1980, 1985a, 1985b, 1991, 1992a, 1992b, 1997). is significant to note that on the wall of the sphinx ditch the. 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Great Sphinx of Giza - RationalWiki

whilst these monoliths show some advanced features of working in stone, they do not represent masonry and can not, therefore, be associated with the sphinx. as my re-dating of the great sphinx has been attacked as impossible by some authorities, other serious researchers have suggested that i have underestimated the true age of the oldest portions of the great sphinx by a factor of ten or more! the sphinx enclosure, if simply carved from the bedrock (as all the evidence suggests) would not have held a deep pool of standing water. when i first presented my findings on the age of the great sphinx, i was told over and over again by mainstream archaeologists and historians that my dating was simply impossible because it was well known that nothing so elaborate and sophisticated, requiring an advanced level of social organisation, could occur so early. of the sphinx) that exhibit no evidence of the precipitation-induced weathering. parkhomenko,7 citing my work, have reinterpreted the geology and erosional features on the great sphinx to mean that the core body of the statue could date back as far as 800,000 years ago. has another line of evidence which centers on what schoch believes to be subsurface weathering of the floor of the sphinx enclosure.. for the earliest parts of the sphinx based on the seismic data. that came out of the sphinx enclosure at a higher level than the blocks that were. this part is a bit technical for me but it was explained to me this way by someone involved in this debate who wished to remain anonymous:“what schoch tried to do was date the exposure of the enclosure floor to dry-air weathering. schoch & robert aquinas mcnally, pyramid quest: secrets of the great pyramid and the dawn of civilization, new york: jeremy p. we pursued around the sphinx, which is in part the basis i used to calibrate a crude. on the giza plateau that were carved from the same member of the mokattam. göbekli tepe proves these assertions false and helps place the great sphinx in a larger context. actually found in the sphinx enclosure (such as the more intense weathering,Erosion, and degradation seen in the western end of the sphinx enclosure, as discussed. the sphinx which have been carved from the same sequence of limestones as the body.. three further lines (s1, s2 and s4) on the north and south of the sphinx, parallel to the body and in front of the paws, indicated weathered rock to 1. suggests that the head of the sphinx may have originally. that the west wall [of the sphinx enclosure] behind the rump [of the sphinx] - -.[line s9] through the sphinx temple east of the great sphinx (dobecki and schoch, 1992). it may progress due to the fact that it is "protected" by the overlying material),The possibility remains open that the initial carving of the great sphinx may be even. my work on the great sphinx has come under fire from a self-described anti-establishmentarian. sphinx was refurbished and partially recarved, including a recarving of the head, in. sides of the body and eastern end of the sphinx were carved, the limestone floor.) i do not find dating the sphinx on the basis of "the known.: in my opinion, the nature and degree of weathering and erosion (degradation) on the sphinx and in the sphinx enclosure is much different than what would be expected if the sphinx had not been carved until 2800 b. argument in favor of a much earlier date for the sphinx. 2i, which both have low durability factors of 11, are greatly receded and undercut. schoch has not written anything new in the scholarly journals about this, he did briefly interact with reader’s points in a point counter-point which i have put together, and will post at the end of the article. in search of such a context, schoch has suggested links with jericho (from where stone masonry is known, ca. the sphinx enclosure on the other three sides of the sculpture. features seen on the body of the sphinx and on the walls of the sphinx enclosure,Then one should expect to observe weathering and erosional features of a similar nature.) if the great sphinx actually had sat in an artificial pool or lake, either the water level around the sphinx would have had to have been the same as that of the surrounding water table, or the walls and floor of the pool in which the sphinx sat would have had to have been sealed up and watertight (and any artificial walls, such as on the eastern end, would have had to have been strong enough to withstand the pressure of the water). on the sphinx and in the sphinx enclosure, then similar weathering and erosional. make a long story short, if schoch is right about this subsurface weathering, he will need to have cores drilled at the site to prove it, as it will be assumed to be the sloping natural bedding otherwise., rising water tables due to encroaching settlement, tourism, automobile and bus traffic,And so forth, may (i believe are) affecting the structures on the giza plateau in a detrimental. with the hypothesis that the fourth dynasty egyptians merely restored,Refurbished, and added to the sphinx and its associated structures, rather than being the. addition reader proposes that the sphinx was carved by an early solar cult on the plateau, which is why the sphinx is facing toward the rising sun. body of the sphinx has been subjected to various repair campaigns,Beginning with the ancient egyptians themselves and continuing up to the present day. pillars inside the sphinx temple stand on rock pedestals - - it seems. (rump) of the sphinx was carved out and freed any later than khafre's time; the rump. first came to the problem of the origin of civilisation through my studies of the great sphinx of giza, egypt.(on the sphinx's right side) are also attributed to khafre (lehner, 1992b, 1997). and erosional features seen on the great sphinx and its associated temples,As compared to weathering seen on other structures attributed to the fourth dynasty,West suggested that the sphinx may predate the fourth dynasty. Dating tips and relationship advice dating the aquarius woman

Searching for the Dawn & Demise of Ancient Civilisation | New

evidence for an older sphinx includes low-energy seismic refraction data. base of the sphinx would not necessarily be accelerated by a moister climate per se. has analyzed the repair campaigns to the sphinx (see lehner,1980; hamblin, 1986), concluding that, despite his own evidence to the contrary, "to seek..According to one standard chronology), the sphinx has not even been situated in a position. this earlier period around the north, east, and south sides of the sphinx (before the. surrounding pit [that is, the sphinx enclosure], and to a somewhat lesser extent, of.(such as lehner and hawass) as to whether the earliest repairs to the sphinx date to the. most recent egyptologists have attributed the carving of the great., like the rest of the core body of the sphinx, been weathered and repaired with. the passage between the western end of the sphinx and the bedrock, more detailed work. the following points: 1) as is described below, the sphinx enclosure may have been. of the first things i think it is important for anyone that believes schoch’s model to understand is that this debate is not really about the sphinx itself, but rather it is mostly about the western side of the enclosure wall in which the sphinx sits.) present on the body of the sphinx, as well as on other structures. tomography data set were collected on the giza plateau during april 1991. arid climatic regime of the giza plateau began approximately in the middle of. there (if they existed) would not invalidate the concept of an older sphinx. "archaeology," the limestones of the giza plateau are criss-crossed with fractures or.-induced weathering features observed on the body of the sphinx and on the. of the rear of the sphinx and the wall of the sphinx ditch one sees that beds 1i. on my geological and seismic analyses, utilising the weathering and erosion patterns correlated with the palaeoclimatology and subsurface features,4 i concluded that the oldest portions of the great sphinx date back to at least the period of 7000 bce to 5000 bce, and perhaps back to 9000 bce or earlier. (see schwaller, 1982), has promulgated an interesting hypothesis: that the great. sphinx carved free from the bedrock, one could suggest that if the back of the sphinx. illustration of the vagaries of geophysical survey is provided by the team from waseda university in japan (yoshimura et al19&20), who used two advanced geophysical techniques within the sphinx enclosure: ground penetrating radar (gpr) and microgravity techniques.. in geology and geophysics from yale university (1983) with a lifelong enthusiasm for ancient cultures, on my first trip to egypt in 1990 i was primed to take a careful look at the sphinx. on the western wall of the sphinx enclosure and the western portion of the.-called valley and sphinx temples, pointing out that some granite blocks have actually. of the sphinx temple, proto-mortuary temple, and "khafre's" causeway to. he argued that the shallower weathering at the rear of the sphinx, indicated that the excavation at this location had been cut more recently. [seismic line s3]) of the great sphinx the identical limestone has only been weathered. or rump (western end) of the sphinx originally merged with the natural rock. the line at the rear of the sphinx (line s3) suggested a depth of weathered limestone in the order of 1. up-slope, will have prevented any significant run-off reaching the sphinx. carving of the core body of the sphinx is estimated to have taken place during. by discrepancies in the depth of subsurface weathering below the floor of the sphinx. despite what a lot of the websites and documentaries that talk about schoch’s theory try to make you believe, the increased period of rainfall that schoch always sites did not just end abruptly 10,000 years ago. of the floor of the sphinx enclosure, the overlying weathering products (the weathered. not only is this date not consistent with the 5000bc date advocated by schoch for the construction of the sphinx, the authors note that the palestinian pots were of a single type and represented only some 3% of the total assemblage. schoch, “life with the great sphinx: some personal reflections”, darklore, vol. my opinion, reader has established that the great sphinx is pre-old kingdom, so now the. enclosure and on the body of the sphinx itself, is incompatible with sporadic flash., 1990, control of porosity on durability of limestone at the great sphinx, egypt. the weathering profile seen on the sphinx and in the sphinx enclosure, then it. suggest the possibility that the initial carving of the great sphinx may. exhibited on the body of the sphinx, and around the area of the giza plateau. Love dating site for free without payment in ahmedabad


Redating the Sphinx: A Prehistoric Sphinx?

of flood damage to the menkaure valley temple on the giza plateau. of the original sphinx structure initially weathered a bit more quickly due to moister. buried under a layer of sand, the sphinx and sphinx enclosure are on the whole protected., estimating the date of the initial carving of the great. formation, standing 66 feet (20 meters) high and 240 feet (73 meters) long,Sits on the edge of the giza plateau (just west of cairo, egypt) east of the three. has taken the time to study the sphinx first-hand, further on these issues:"[robert schoch] presented his findings . what schoch did was measure the depth of weathered rock using sound waves (these bounce back very fast if the rock is sound and more slowly if it has weathered). if the moat theory were true, then the lower strata on the eastern end of the sphinx enclosure would be most heavily eroded (caused by water being brought in via canals from the nile), but the opposite is seen in reality. the sphinx enclosure wall can only be produced by water, primarily precipitation, and do. many ways this debate comes down to rainfall, when was it happening at giza, and how much of it was there? schoch’s conclusion, that the seismic survey indicates anomalous shallow weathering at the rear of the sphinx, is only one possible interpretation of the data. obviously,If the limestone cores (originating from the sphinx ditch) of the temples predate the..(that is the initial carving of the core body of the sphinx is approximately 50% to 100%.(#1, above) is the oldest predominant mode of weathering identified on the giza plateau. the absolute dating of the earliest portions of the sphinx, but i do believe that. sphinx is made up of three different types of limestone, each with different strengths. as the weathering elsewhere across the floor of the enclosure is between ‘fifty to 100%’ deeper, schoch argued that the enclosure had been excavated some 50 to 100% earlier than the fourth dynasty – that is about 7000 to 5000bc. patterns seen on the body of the sphinx and the walls of the sphinx enclosure. he also proposes that it likely once had the head of lion and not a man, but that the head was carved down to look like the head of khafre during the time that the sphinx was integrated into khafre’s memorial complex, which may explain the current disproportionately small head in relation to the bigger body. and no, standing water in the sphinx enclosure would not accelerate the depth of weathering below the floor of the enclosure. dating of manichev and parkhomenko could push the age of the great sphinx into a very remote time period, one that has been suggested for possible, but ambiguous, ancient structures, sculptures, or simulacra that are found in many parts of the world, such as markawasi in peru,8 the romanian sphinx,9 or a possible stone circle dubbed adam’s calendar by researchers johan heine and michael tellinger with a claimed date of 75,000 years ago. sphinx (discussed below), and considering the fact that the attribution of the sphinx. has also been suggested that the sphinx has been heavily weathered.. furthermore, their explanation of hydraulic and capillary action, quoted above,Does not address the discrepancies in subsurface weathering seen within the sphinx. this is exactly what is to be expected based on the palaeohydrology of the giza plateau and is incompatible with a moat theory where it is hypothesised that water was brought in from the nile to the east. the sphinx, particularly the damage currently being done by mobilized salts (see for. that the sphinx underwent restoration during the old kingdom because the analysis. current destruction of the sphinx (brookes, 1992; egyptian antiquities organization,1992; hedges, 1992). wind-induced weathering is also observed on the present head of the great. in my 1992 kmt paper titled "redating the great sphinx of giza" (see especially.) the highest levels of the middle member strata, as seen in the sphinx enclosure on the western end, are most severely eroded, which is compatible with the agency of precipitation. campaigns to the body of the sphinx"), the vast majority of the weathering and. around the base of the sphinx into account, as a first approximation i have simply. that the excavation of the sphinx pre-dates khufu's early fourth dynasty. suggested that sand piled up for centuries in the sphinx enclosure has been wetted by. clearly, there was much activity on the giza plateau during the fourth.. the body of the sphinx, carved from the local bedrock and thus sitting in the. strongly suggests that the entire sphinx ditch was not excavated at one time. the sphinx, the rock must have become wet to a considerable depth, and as it dried. had the back (western end) of the great sphinx carved out and freed from the cliff. temple (sitting directly in front of the great sphinx) and valley temple. much later than the core body, and the head of the sphinx has been recarved., there is evidence that the current surface of the floor of the sphinx temple is lower. in addition,We located various voids, cavities, and other subsurface features (see dobecki and schoch,Analysis of the seismic data collected in april of 1991 contributes.

GEO ExPro - The Great Sphinx of Egypt: Nature's Shabby-Chic Trick?

well known that the sphinx has been refurbished and reworked many times over the. known moister conditions on the giza plateau prior to the middle third millennium b.(1994) have stated that "ancient and modern weathering on the sphinx are, for the most part,The same ball game.’s  early date for the sphinx has been subsequently used by folks like graham hancock to support his theory of the existence of ancient civilizations like atlantis. in egypt recently (march 2009) i made it a point to look at the great sphinx and sphinx enclosure with fresh eyes to see if there could be anything to the moat class of theories. halfway up the body of the sphinx) has a calculated durability factor of. according to brophy, three stones inside the nabta calendar circle represent the belt of orion (just as the three pyramids of giza represent the belt of orion according the research of robert bauval13). the great sphinx and sphinx temple sit on a steep cliff (now buried in sand [seismic., but also the evidence for the two-stage construction of the sphinx and valley temples. i find it quite conceivable that architectural stonework was being pursued at giza prior to 2800 or 3000 b. schoch has taken this in support of his pre-5000bc date for the sphinx, arguing that the rainfall which eroded the early sphinx had ended by the time the later mudbrick tombs were built. of the site, the distribution of degradation within the sphinx enclosure. furthermore, the dates of the nabta structures are in line with my dating of the oldest portions of the great sphinx, and at both giza and nabta the constellation of orion (which represented the god osiris during dynastic times) was of prime importance. effect under extreme arid conditions with the sphinx exposed to the elements.. it strains credulity to believe that the amount, type, and degree of precipitation-induced erosion seen in the sphinx enclosure was produced in only a few centuries.. schoch, “seismic investigations in the vicinity of the great sphinx of giza, egypt”, geoarchaeology, vol. baigent describes how many of the pottery remains encountered during the archaeological excavation at maadi, were clearly influenced by jericho – evidence, he concluded, that people from jericho had settled in maadi, bringing with them their knowledge of working masonry and, he implies, building the sphinx., condensation affects all monuments in the giza complex,But very rarely do any show the same type of weathering features of the sphinx, surrounding. admittedly, i have dwelt on those that most interest me, including the great sphinx with which i have become entwined. i considered such notions carefully as far back as my early analyses of the geology of the sphinx, starting in 1990., 1983c, facies and origin of nummulitic buildups:An example from the giza pyramids plateau (middle eocene, egypt). lal gauri also is playing, and has in the past played a major role in the erosion of the sphinx. rainfall during reader’s revised construction date (400 years earlier than the mainstream view, but 2500-5000 years later than schoch’s) was more than enough to produce the erosion seen at the sphinx site.[on the body of the sphinx and in the sphinx enclosure] are caused by rainfall that has. schoch, “introduction”, in markawasi: peru’s inexplicable stone forest (ed. this phenomenon from observations made in the process of mapping the sphinx. this view is contrasted with schoch’s initial assertions which stressed that direct rain was the cause of the erosion of the sphinx enclosure, not rain run-off such as reader proposed. that was carried out on the giza plateau with thomas dobecki (see comments above). geophysical surveys (dobecki, 1992; dobecki and schoch,1992) indicate that the subsurface weathering in the sphinx enclosure is not uniform. of weathering and erosion (degradation) features on the body of the sphinx and in. and into the sphinx enclosure) to account for the pattern of degradation. that either there was wet sand in the sphinx enclosure for long periods of time. it through the limestone on the west side of the sphinx enclosure. the surface layer of the rock of the sphinx), we must work with the evidence at hand. genesis of ancient weathering and erosional features on the sphinx. i continue to believe that the erosional features on the sphinx and in the sphinx enclosure indicate a much earlier date than 3000 or 2800 b. if you do an image search for “water erosion sphinx” or a similar phrase, you will not typically see close up pictures of the sphinx itself, instead you will see a lot of pictures of the western enclosure wall, and the western side of the southern enclosure wall. end of the sphinx was still protected by a thick layer of solid rock."in parts of the statue [the sphinx], the limestone is highly porous and cavernous. times - - originally it may not have even looked like a sphinx; see schoch with. and refurbished the great sphinx, the sphinx temple, and the valley temple, he.) there is much heavier surface erosion on the western end of the sphinx enclosure, and the surface erosion tapers off dramatically toward the eastern end of the enclosure.. lehner [1991] and hassan [1949] both suggest that the sphinx and surroundings. to the onset of the current arid regime exhibited on the giza plateau (i.

Sphinx water erosion hypothesis - Wikipedia

Redating the Sphinx

to the eroded body of the sphinx do date to old kingdom times, this is another. body of the sphinx predates old kingdom times by perhaps several millennia..Reader: having advocated a pre 5000bc date for the excavation of the sphinx, schoch has attempted to establish a role or context for his early sphinx. the sphinx is carved], will suffer from morning dew condensation that dissolves salts. of the giza plateau would give a very different pattern of degradation than is. this putative red paint, however, may actually consist,In part, of natural weathering products of the rock, although the sphinx may have been. and to a certain degree on the uppermost portion of the back of the sphinx as well. out some low-level seismic work in the vicinity of the great sphinx with the. in summary, such moat and related theories do not hold water (to use a bad pun) and are not compatible with the features of the actual great sphinx, the sphinx enclosure, and the general geology and palaeohydrology of the giza plateau. south walls of the sphinx enclosure, insisting that these are too ["too" is stressed by. been exposed as a nice vertical profile along the northern wall of the sphinx. the giza plateau and correlates with the nature and degree of the surface weathering. of the sphinx once having been a prominent rock outlier, and i have stated so. of limestones as the body of the sphinx, exhibit well-developed wind-induced. schoch associated this restoration with excavation at the rear of the sphinx and, on this basis, argued that the more shallow weathering represented a late phase of excavation, limited to the rear of the sphinx enclosure, which had been undertaken in the fourth dynasty. i also consider run-off to be a significant agent of degradation at the sphinx. quarried during khafre's time in the rear of the sphinx enclosure. on the sides and front of the sphinx as compared to the floor in back of the sphinx,We can estimate that the initial carving of the great sphinx (i. to oversimplify a bit, the core body of the great sphinx shows features that place it well back before the onset of the current arid regime (the giza plateau is on the edge of the sahara desert) some 5,000 years ago. the sides and front (eastern portion) of the body of the great sphinx were carved free. the weathering and erosion of the sphinx and sphinx enclosure (harrell, 1994). and archaeological evidence for the age of the sphinx and a revised sequence of. temple was constructed at the same time as the carving of the great sphinx, this. for the sphinx, or at least keep it dynastic, just doesn't work. great sphinx of giza to the old kingdom pharaoh khafre (chephren), ca. suggest that the great sphinx was built in very early dynastic times or late. (here i will not address his hypotheses, which i do not find persuasive, that the sphinx was the jackal [wild dog] anubis and the face seen on the sphinx is that of the middle kingdom pharaoh amenemhet ii, though i would point out that the original sphinx has been reworked and the head has been re-carved, perhaps more than once. the sphinx and valley temples is attributable to khafre (see, for instance, hawass,1990, 1998). asserts that i have dated the great sphinx to 7,000+ b. features found on the body of the sphinx and on the walls of the sphinx. to counter reader's analysis by claiming, based on admittedly anecdotal evidence,That rainfall runoff still reaches the sphinx enclosure and thus the degradation features. for the sculpturing of the sphinx should be taken with extreme caution and therefore. meters] above the present floor of the sphinx enclosure at the rump),Which to this day remains immediately west of the sphinx within the general sphinx enclosure;. schoch with robert aquinas mcnally, voices of the rocks: a scientist looks at catastrophes and ancient civilizations, new york: harmony books, 1999. have served more to promote the preservation of the sphinx. number of "types of weathering" that they claim are taking place in the sphinx enclosure,But it quickly becomes evident that they have little understanding of the topic. (see below) -- in the case of the great sphinx and its associated temples,Weathering that was possibly covered up or repaired during the old kingdom (circa 2600-2400. of the sphinx: it has taken about 4,500 years for the subsurface weathering.“nowhere has he [schoch] ever given any evidence to support this claim. enclosure and body of the sphinx have been buried in sand, and thus effectively. and weathering seen in the sphinx enclosure, and also nicely correlates with the. the date is incredibly early, even earlier than my “conservative” estimate for the date of the great sphinx. and their distribution as actually observed in the sphinx enclosure. in summary, in order to save the attribution of the sphinx to khafre (chephren),Circa 2500 b.

Geological Evidence Pertaining to the Age of The Great Sphinx

Robert M. Schoch — Wikipédia

, such as tombs directly north of the sphinx on the eastern edge of the giza., the important issue is whether or not the sphinx is pre-old kingdom. the great sphinx was built in stages (originally it may not have even been a sphinx). may have originally been a lion in the 1993 video "the mystery of the sphinx"). schoch’s argument can be summarised as follows:After excavation of the sphinx, the newly exposed rocks, particularly the floor of the enclosure, began to weather. basically grew up believing the theory proposed by robert schoch and john anthony west in 1992 that the sphinx was eroded by water and, as the story goes, the only time that could have happened was about 5000-7000 bc. these early tombs, which conventionally are considered to pre-date the sphinx, show little evidence of degradation by rainfall. of the sphinx and in the ditch or hollow surrounding the great sphinx. without going off on such limbs, there is clear evidence for early high culture at a remote period beyond just that of the great sphinx.. schoch with mcnally, 2003; undoubtedly this list is incomplete, especially for the period between 10,900 bce and 3150 bce. schoch and afterword by john anthony west), new york: writers club press (iuniverse), 2002; mark h. as i have already stated schoch’s model emphasized that rainfall, not rain run-off was responsible for the deep erosion on the western enclosure wall, and therefore schoch needs a lot of rainfall, and a lot of time to make his theory workable. sphinx enclosure does not follow the bedding of the strata. on the uppermost limestone blocks of the valley and sphinx temples., when in fact according to reader the “excavation of the sphinx” should be. unlike the sphinx temple particularly, which consists of carefully quarried, worked and placed masonry, the nabta circle is built from roughly hewn blocks. check out reader’s responses to schoch below, as far as i know there has been no further public interactions after that point. even if occasional heavy rains occur on the giza plateau,The fact remains that currently on average only about an inch of rain each year occurs. core of the sphinx temple (and also probably the valley temple) must be as old. in addition, they state that the depth of weathering indicated by s4 (in front of the sphinx) approached 4m, not the 2. 4-5) state:"burial of the sphinx for centuries under the desert sand has, it appears, resulted in..1) based on my observations and analyses, the sphinx temple (built out of blocks removed from the sphinx enclosure when the body of the sphinx was initially carved) and the so-called valley temple to the south of the sphinx temple show clear signs of heavy precipitation-induced weathering on the limestone core blocks. schoch with robert aquinas mcnally, voyages of the pyramid builders: the true origins of the pyramids from lost egypt to ancient america, new york: jeremy p. far as i am aware schoch has never interacted with readers’s responses to his criticisms ( which are listed below), nor has he explained why he thinks the limestone rocks would need more time or more water than what there was during reader’s earlier date.“schoch has made the point that i have not commented on the geophysical data that he had obtained from within the sphinx enclosure, nor have i considered the implications of this work on the dating of the sphinx. deterioration of the sphinx is due to the migration of salts under the influence of. as i said almost all parties agree, including schoch and reader, that the erosion seen on the sphinx itself is caused by a number of factors including rainfall (not run-off. western enclosure, then this calculation pushes the date for the great sphinx's.(schoch,1995a), much of the hawass-lehner argument (hawass and lehner, 1994; see also hawass,1998, and lehner, 1980, 1985a, 1985b, 1991, 1992a, 1992b, 1997), which is in large part based. sphinx (see schoch, 1992a, 1992b, 1992c, 1992d, 1992e, 1993a, 1993b, 1994a, 1994b,1995a, 1995b, 2000; schoch with mcnally, 1999, 2000; schoch and west, 1991; west, 1993a,1993b; see also moore, 1992, and payn, 1992). core body of the sphinx predated the time of khafre. weathering and erosion seen on the core body of the sphinx itself. it seems that schoch is endorsing this lion view on his website too. seismic work performed around the base of the sphinx consisted of hitting a sledgehammer. as discussed by harrell11, there are other equally valid interpretations, including one in particular that may cast some doubt on schoch’s interpretation. schoch considered that if the sphinx had been carved in one operation, the depth of weathering below the floor of the sphinx enclosure would be uniform. clearly, the ancient water table was well below the level of the floor of the sphinx enclosure (or else the sphinx temple, for instance, would have been flooded). reasons that colin reader proposed that khafre didnt build the sphinx often were the same ones that schoch was using with a few notable differences. unlike the sphinx and menkaure’s valley temple, however, the mudbrick tombs at saqqara were built on an area of high ground and do not lie within any natural catchment. records up to 100% deeper weathering below the original floor of the sphinx. paper entitled "khufu knew the sphinx" (the copy i received from him is dated. their work on the weathering of the sphinx gauri and his colleagues. sphinx which give data on the subsurface depth and distribution of weathering around. for the age of the earliest excavations in the sphinx enclosure.

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